"Sugar is Toxic"
"Sugar Causes Fatty Liver"
"Sugar Causes Diabetes"
Here is my n=1 case study eating ≈400g of sugar (≈200g of fructose) per day for close to 10 years with my most recent metabolic blood markers.
The 𝗥𝗮𝘆 𝗣𝗲𝗮𝘁 𝗙𝗼𝗿𝘂𝗺 is not what it used to be.
I show examples of what I mean in the video below👇
The TLDR is there's no more:
-Open Discussion
-Friendly Debate
-Varied Perspectives
-Discussion of Dr. Peat's Ideas
The Forum is Dead.
51,148 Eggs a WEEK to get Vitamin A Toxicity? 🍳☠️
(This extreme example is based on the Studies cited by The Low Vitamin A Guru himself, Grant Genereaux, in his book Poisoning For Profits)
Basically, his own studies contradict his perspective
Let me explain🧵
Imagine this:
Theres a new diet.
It's based around the idea that Vitamin A is toxic.
It changes 10 to 100's of different components simultaneously.
If people get better on the diet, the proponents say it must be because you're eliminating vitamin A.
𝗕𝗜𝗢𝗘𝗡𝗘𝗥𝗚𝗘𝗧𝗜𝗖 𝗖𝗢𝗙𝗙𝗘𝗘 𝘃𝘀. 𝗕𝗨𝗟𝗟𝗘𝗧𝗣𝗥𝗢𝗢𝗙 𝗖𝗢𝗙𝗙𝗘𝗘 🥊
𝗕𝗶𝗼𝗲𝗻𝗲𝗿𝗴𝗲𝘁𝗶𝗰 𝗖𝗼𝗳𝗳𝗲𝗲 𝗢𝗱𝗱𝘀 (-1000) 👊
•Mike Tyson in his prime
𝗕𝘂𝗹𝗹𝗲𝘁𝗽𝗿𝗼𝗼𝗳 𝗖𝗼𝗳𝗳𝗲𝗲 (+1250) 📉
•Layne Norton after his 5th back surgery, and a bottle of
My gallbladder has been in near constant pain for several months. Nutrition has been off the rails, been trying as much as I can but have had to force it every single day. Going to try liver/gallbladder flushes (only have once before). Suggestions appreciated. Please pray for me.
List of Low Carb Guru's who have transitioned or appear to be transitioning (no not that type of transition), into the Bioenergetic sphere:
-Dr. Mercola
-Paul Saladino
-Dave Asprey
-Thomas Delauer
@ElieJarrougeMD
In Modern Medicine its always important to miss the forest for the trees 👍
Although adding some fruit to that animal based diet will fix that LDL problem real quick.
Seeing LDL drop when adding in fruit to an animal based diet is what I see over and over with my clients.
@8888chrome8888
This would be more of a success if he didn't try to get his carbs from apples.
Sorbitol + Imbalanced glucose to fructose ratio = Gut irritation
This isn't necessarily a metabolic issue, it is a gut issue.
This is a mistake many low carbers make in their transition.
@BradCohn
Appreciate the Support Brad, and what you did with the new forum 👍
It's upsetting to see Ray's name being associated with this. It's antithetical to his work.
Interesting that Charlie wants to talk negatively about me publicly on the forum, but banned me a few days ago.
𝗙𝗿𝘂𝗰𝘁𝗼𝘀𝗲 𝗦𝗵𝗼𝘂𝗹𝗱 𝗡𝗼𝘁 𝗕𝗲 𝗗𝗶𝗳𝗳𝗶𝗰𝘂𝗹𝘁 𝘁𝗼 𝗗𝗶𝗴𝗲𝘀𝘁
Unless you are making this key dietary mistake..
Follow this simple principle to 𝗲𝗮𝘁 𝗮𝗹𝗹 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗙𝗿𝘂𝗰𝘁𝗼𝘀𝗲 𝘆𝗼𝘂 𝗱𝗲𝘀𝗶𝗿𝗲 𝘄𝗶𝘁𝗵𝗼𝘂𝘁 𝗚𝗜 𝗗𝗶𝘀𝘁𝗿𝗲𝘀𝘀
Stay Tuned For:
1. A full video breakdown of Grant's perspective on Vitamin A Deficiency
2. A full video breakdown on Vitamin A Absorption, Metabolism, Excretion, & Storage
3. Video outlining alternative explanations for why the Low Vitamin A Diet may be working for you
@Outdoctrination
I think the obvious answer here is genetics. All of these organisms are just genetically predisposed to become obese.
With this in mind, we all know that the solution here is clearly semaglutide.
That's right $15k a year to keep lassie lean.
Bonus: Less money on dog food
@anabology
I think the ability to listen and entertain opposing ideas without taking them as personal attacks is indicative of the level of development of the individual.
When an individual has knee jerk negative responses, I question the quality of their thought processes in other areas.
When someone questions the theory...
Or when someone brings up contradictions...
Or when someone presents alternative evidence...
They are silenced, banned, blocked, etc.
Can anyone provide a good argument for Ozempic?
-Drug induced starvation via slowing GI transit, nausea and vomiting
-20-50% lean mass loss when using
-≈70% of people drop off at the 2 year mark
-≈70% of fat mass regained 1 year following cessation
@exfatloss
Interesting Post.
I respectfully ask that next time you avoid:
1. Mischaracterizing our arguments
2. Positioning our perspectives as your own
3. Injecting your veiled personal vendetta
4. Feigning objectivity
5. Positioning yourself as an arbiter while sowing dissent
This my friends describes a vocal portion of the "Vitamin A is toxic" crowd.
This isn't everyone.
There are many people who are just trying to figure out how to improve their health.
But then there are dangerous individuals like the admin Charlie on The Ray Peat Forum...
With this in mind:
Both Dr. Mercola, and Paul Saladino have directly acknowledged Dr. Peat 👍
Thomas Delauer seems to be hesitant in fully transitioning 👩🔄👨🦱
And Dave Asprey seems fine largely positioning the ideas discussed in the bioenergetic sphere as the ideas that he has always had from the beginning...
With only a minor nod to Dr. Peat.... 🤔
I break this down further here:
Who have developed an anti-intellectual messiah complex.
Who have single handedly:
-Dishonored Ray Peat's Legacy
-Undermined Intellectual honesty
-Stifled the search for answers/ truth
-Ostracized some of the brightest members of the bioenergetic community
So, with these studies in mind, we are left with a few questions:
Is Grant Genereaux right about Vitamin A being extremely toxic?
Is there a conspiracy to poison us with Vitamin A?
Are eggs "killing you" as
@ThorTorrens
states?
Losing the weight via drug induced starvation doesn't:
-Minimize PUFA intake
-Correct micronutrient deficiencies
-Address underlying hormonal issues
-Correct microbiome dysfunction
-Organize the lifestyle
-Etc.
As with most things in life, there's no free lunch.
This isn't about the specifics of whether vitamin A is toxic or not.
This is about silencing the ability to debate and objectively determine the toxicity of vitamin A.
This is directly antithetical to truth seeking and antithetical to helping individuals improve their health.
@rosenfeltc
@exfatloss
Of all of the diets, high protein, low carb, low fat, is one of the most problematic from a hormonal perspective.
Great way to trash thyroid, and sex steroids, while raising stress hormones like cortisol.
@ThorTorrens
More bold unsubstantiated claims.
I wonder if I join "one of one" if there will be evidence provided that "vitamin A causes all of the autoimmune disease".
Open to the hypothesis, would like to actually see the support.
Grant's Perspective is Questionable in 2 major areas.
1. Equating Dosages Between Rats vs. Humans
2. Equating Relative Life spans between rats vs. humans
@faustianpeatler
Agreed.
I also don't think this means going straight to T3 & T4 use.
The bodies context usually has to be improved first, at least in my experience, to be able to tolerate T3/T4.
It is possible for an individual to avoid T3/ T4 if their foundation is dialed in correctly.
@Outdoctrination
Taurine is great.
However, it can cause bile acid malabsorption in susceptible people and also an overgrowth of hydrogen sulphide producing bacteria by shifting bile comp. to taurine conjugated bile acids.
In this circumstance it's no bueno.
I know this pretty personally.
Why not learn how to eat/ live/ move appropriately so that:
-The results can be maintained long term
-The negative GI effects can be avoided
-You dont lose your lean body mass
-You don't nuke your hormonal profile
@TakeThiamine
@ThinPicking
@BradCohn
@NutriDetect
No worries he can recede into his safe space while simultaneously broadcasting his character publicly.
Between his and Charlie's behavior, I'm surprised anyone even decides to listen to the anti-vitamin A arguments at all.
Below are the human equivalent Vitamin A dosages in the form of eggs, beef liver, & cod liver oil on a per week or per day basis for each study referenced by Grant.
(Spoiler Alert: Not even Liver King eats this much Liver)
STUDY
#1
(rat study)
51,148 eggs per week
1,500 beef liver per week
1,000 Tbs of cod liver oil per week
This was done for 10 - 18 days in rats which is proportionally equivalent to roughly 9 to 18 months for a human.
Grant’s own citations corroborate this. If anything his own source gives a threshold of 40,000IU/ day.
"Normal doses of vitamin A are not associated with liver injury or liver test abnormalities, but higher doses (generally more than 40,000 IU daily) can be toxic."
When people get worse on the diet, they say it's just a detox reaction.
Then if the individual gets continually worse overtime, they say "give it some more time, it takes years to detox vitamin A".
And it gets even better...
Dr. Steve here has been avoiding vitamin A for two years and his liver is still pumping it out into his serum.
Are you absolutely SURE you need that vitamin A supplement or liver meat?
Make no mistake, this is a 5 year detoxification, but benefits come along the way.
@AlpacaAurelius
200lb person ≈ 145g/day of glucose just for the CNS
In humans, the brain accounts for ~2% of the body weight, but it consumes ~20% of glucose-derived energy making it the main consumer of glucose (~5.6 mg glucose per 100 g human brain tissue per minute [2]).
@MindOfIntra
Also to be fair your question mischaracterized the Bioenergetic perspective quite a bit and set up a poor frame.
-Thyroid isn't the magnum opus, energy metabolism is.
-Thyroid was never positioned as the sole problem.
-The beauty of the perspective is nuanced simplicity.
STUDY
#2
(rat study)
21,994 eggs per day
645 ounces of beef liver per day
430 Tbs of cod liver per day
This was for 10 days in rats which is proportionally equivalent to roughly 9 months for a human.
STUDY
#3
(this was unfortunately observed in a newborn baby)
- 312 eggs per day for a new born
- 9 ounces of beef liver a day for a new born
- 6 Tbs of cod liver oil per day for a new born
@AlpacaAurelius
I think the biggest concern with too frequent snacking and the MMC, is the effect it may have on clearing debris from the small intestine including microbes.
This may set the stage for SIBO.
SIBO then can set the stage for gut derived toxins to create issues at the liver.
@exfatloss
Also, Grant has been invited to speak with us on the podcast that you just criticized.
More than happy to discuss these studies with him face to face 👍
I'll let you come to your own conclusions, but here is what we know from the research:
Acute toxicity generally occurs with intakes at 100x the RDA for adults, and 20x the RDA for kids. Greater than 25,000IU/ day for 6 years can lead to chronic toxicity.
@bioenergy_space
I have an in depth video on GLP-1 agonists dropping this week.
In terms of protein, research seems to indicate the optimal protein target is around 0.82g/lb/day.
Resistance training would also be prudent here.
If you're going to do these two things, why even use the drugs?
What I would like to further see from these gentleman is:
-An understanding of individual context
-An engagement with the central importance of energy metabolism
-An incorporation of the physiology of stress
-Direct acknowledgment of Dr. Peat's Influence
@SolBrah
@bitcoinand_beef
@daylightco
Now if you could minimize the nnEMF from the tablet, then you'd have a product that I would buy 👍
If your going to protect the circadian rhythm then you might as well dial in the voltage gated calcium channels
Perhaps this is an opportunity to open up the market for Lifi?
@joe_dycus67
I don't know how much vitamin A your liver has. This is irrelevant to the conversation.
40,000IU per day was not discussed as "safe for everyone".
Yearly accumulation was directly mentioned.
Please reread the thread friend, this isn't a personal attack on you, or your liver 👍
@ThorTorrens
Is this the type of valuable information that we can get inside One of Ones?
I was really looking for more exaggerated unsubstantiated claims to improve my health
@Will_of_Europa
Fiber binding bile isn't revolutionary.
Bile isnt necessarily an "enemy". Its important in detox, digestion, and microbiome regulation.
Toxins are still produced during carnivore by bacterial fermentation of amino acids, bile acids, etc. in the colon.
Agreed on carbs tho👍
@Mqsley
@AndyJScott
Me: "This low vitamin A stuff seems like it has some holes to it. I wonder what's going on."
Low Vitamin A: "Just Read Grant's Book"
Me: Reads Grants Book and cited studies, discusses some of the holes
Low Vitamin A: "It's just a take down of Grants Book"
Me: ?
@KenDBerryMD
2 different generalized contexts for weight gain:
1) A surplus of food (molecules)
2) Issues in extracting energy from said food (molecules), leading to a shunting of the food (molecules) into storage. This leaves the cells with an energy deficit.
#2
is the primary problem
@NutriDetect
Thanks for enlightening us "Detective".
A couple questions, so I can learn more about your math:
-Is excretion the only element to focus on? What about utilization?
-How do we determine the rate of excretion?
-Whats the threshold for toxicity?
I invite and expect the trend to continue as these gentleman walk back ideas on:
-Fasting
-Low carb dieting
-Fears around fruit/ juice/ fructose
-Omega 3 Polyunsaturated
If you are still having GI problems with these foods consider:
A) FODMAP's as the primary trigger and avoid these foods
or
B) A possible gut dysbiosis is at play, and needs to be treated
@thelukelamy
Thanks for having me on Luke, it was a pleasure speaking. I enjoyed the conversation quite a bit.
Looking forward to the next time we can riff about things.
@ChrisMasterjohn
@dannyroddy
@BradCohn
@haidut
Ray was indeed a proponent of carb oxidation over fat oxidation as you suggested Chris.
But he was also a proponent of context.
To be fair though, I haven't read too much research on Vitamin K3 so these posts are more to respond to your comments on Ray.
@ChrisMasterjohn
@dannyroddy
@BradCohn
@haidut
While a portion of the uncoupling seen with thyroid seems to be driven in part by FFA, some of it also seems to be driven by direct effects on the respiratory chain and uncoupling proteins themselves.
@ThinPicking
Thanks for the support ThinPicking!
The lack of respect for Ray's name and work is one of the biggest contributing factors to me making this video.
@Steen_oh
@maxlugavere
@Puucktalk
As you say this, multiple "longevity experts" are doing 180's on the "sugar is bad" schtick.
Mercola, Asprey, Saladino...
When your favorite longevity expert makes the switch, whoever that is, are you going to still post comments like this?
@cavepaleo
"These findings suggest to be less than 1% the probability of aspirin use to increase the risk of HF by 15% or more. This analysis reached a statistical power of 80.78%."
PMID: 36572648
First, exercise + diet is likely more effective.
Second, to prevent the lean mass loss, and weight regain:
-Adequate protein intake is likely required
-Resistance training/ exercise is required
Why not just fix the rest of the diet?
You're already 75% of the way there.
@cavepaleo
"A total of 14 studies with a combined study population of 64,550 patients were included in the final analysis. All-cause mortality was found to be significantly lower in patients who were taking ASA [Aspirin] (P = 0.003)."
PMID: 33613799
@TakeThiamine
@BradCohn
@NutriDetect
I took a sarcastic tone because Garret's initial post had a condescending tone.
At least to me, he speaks to the audience as if they are below him.
To me his brand image is not about helping people, it appears to be about authority. At least on twitter.
What Causes Fructose Malabsorption?
Introducing the 𝗚𝗹𝘂𝗰𝗼𝘀𝗲 : 𝗙𝗿𝘂𝗰𝘁𝗼𝘀𝗲 𝗥𝗮𝘁𝗶𝗼
Glucose increases absorption of fructose in the intestine via upregulation of GLUT 2.